Process-one
ejabberd
ejabberd@conference.process-one.net
Friday, March 15, 2019< ^ >
zinid has set the subject to: ejabberd discussions: https://docs.ejabberd.im
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[07:11:27] <Tyler> Is there a historic reason why the default shaper rule limits traffic to 1000 bytes per second?
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[07:30:44] <zinid> Tyler, sure, in 2002 servers were not that performant and it was much easier to flood them
[07:31:27] <zinid> also, initially ejabberd was written for jabber.ru and it was constantly flooded
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[08:46:32] <erik> zinid: would you say modern jabber wants a higher limit?
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[08:46:58] <zinid> probably
[08:47:18] <zinid> to speed up login procedure maybe?
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[08:48:44] <Holger> And fetching larger stuff such as avatars.
[08:49:23] <erik> Hmm. Good points. I should look at my setup there
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[08:55:33] <zinid> ah, since we removed in ejabberd a lot of places of potential congestion, shapers don't mean that much
[08:55:50] <zinid> I personally don't even have them configured on my personal server
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[08:56:40] <erik> Ok. That's an interesting thought. I should try running without them for a while
[08:57:22] <zinid> even during DoS attack, ejabberd won't allow queues to fill up indefinitely, it has various protections we introduced in recent years
[08:57:49] <Licaon_Kter> zinid: not configured means "as default" or "really large" ?
[08:58:23] <zinid> Licaon_Kter, not configured, there is no default
[08:58:34] <zinid> so basically the traffic speed in unrestricted
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[09:00:22] <Licaon_Kter> Ok, I was expecting some defaults, for "safety"
[09:00:41] <Licaon_Kter> ....like (all?) other values have.
[09:00:51] <zinid> "safety" is maintained by max_fsm_queue and oom_killer
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[09:02:30] <zinid> I can explain what that means, this needs to understand ejabberd design a bit
[09:02:33] <zinid> but I'm lazy
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[09:06:41] <Licaon_Kter> Yeah whatever
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[10:16:16] <Holger> zinid: Though maybe shapers still make some sense to protect individual users/sessions (as opposed to the whole service)?
[10:17:25] <Holger> zinid: I mean to make it harder for me to kill your session's process by flooding.
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[10:32:15] <Holger> Licaon_Kter: https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-bifrost/issues/53#issuecomment-471338824
[10:32:35] <Holger> Licaon_Kter: I thought he said something like "it's fixed already, gonna deploy later today" some time ago.
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[10:33:24] <Holger> Whatever, the longer it stays that way the longer there's an amusing example of how bridges suck.
[10:34:01] <Licaon_Kter> Holger: yup, and I've asked there the next day....but maybe it was this instead
https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-bifrost/issues/51
[10:36:33] <Holger> Simulacrum?  Damn I never took Latin at school ...
[10:37:33] <Holger> > Delivery failures can only really happen if the remote bridge or server(s) don't accept them, however we have no technique for telling the client about these.
[10:37:37] <Holger> Wasn't aware.
[10:38:32] <SouL> We use that word for emergency rehearsals or however is called. Like if there's a fire, we go out of the building and so on.
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[10:40:20] <Holger> Hmmm the context is:
> When you kick a Matrix Simulacrum from a MUC, it's not reflected on the Matrix side appropriately.
[10:40:32] <Holger> I was honestly unsure what he's talking about.
[10:40:39] <SouL> I saw Ge0rg using that word for this case, Holger.
[10:40:53] <SouL> He was using it for somebody that is joined by a bridge, if I'm not mistaken.
[10:41:07] <SouL> So, a user in a MUC that is joined from Matrix.
[10:41:14] <Holger> German Wikipedia says it's "lookalike" or so.
[10:41:44] <Holger> Yes probably.
[10:41:47] <SouL> I would find another word for that concept but well
[10:44:17] <Holger> Yes it's kinda important to understand that word for understanding the issue :-)
[10:46:36] <SouL> Even though I speak to languages that come from latin, Simulacrum still sounds like magic related haha
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[13:32:07] <Akasch> gajim    
[13:32:25] <poVoq> what about it?
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[13:38:18] <Holger> marc: I seem to remember you're the author of XEP-0401 and you started implementing it for ejabberd?  Is that right?
[13:38:27] <Holger> If so, was there any outcome?
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[13:49:17] <marc> Holger: I had a working PoC for ejabberd and C
[13:49:59] <marc> The main "problem" was consistency with PARS and protocol stuff
[13:50:01] <Holger> And then zinid was annoyed of Georg and Daniel not interested? :-)
[13:50:09] <Holger> Hmm.
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[13:50:37] <marc> No IIRC Daniel said he would implement it
[13:50:40] <Holger> Is the diff still online somewhere?
[13:50:41] <marc> Or merge it
[13:50:43] <Holger> Ah.
[13:51:08] <marc> > Is the diff still online somewhere?
No, but I could upload it
[13:51:21] <marc> Are you interested in 401?
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[13:52:07] <Holger> Well, someone I'm doing contract work for is interested ;-)
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[13:52:37] <Holger> Or, well, he isn't aware of that XEP, but the use-case he'd like to have implemented sounds like it might make sense to be based on 401.
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[16:00:37] <erik> Holger, marc : that's actually a *very* nice XEP! I have been using XMPP for years, but last week I on-boarded the rest of the family. Would have been a nice feature to be able to click a link, choose a password and be off on a new server (based on an invite)
[16:00:47] <erik> would have saved me some work last weekend!
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[16:05:09] <marc> erik: yes, just some protocol stuff needs to be fixed
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[16:07:24] <erik> I imagine it'll go very well with the Quicksy idea.
[16:07:47] <erik> also, I'm very happy to see people think about how to advance the ecosystem, not just the server or client.
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[16:12:30] <poVoq> 👍
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[16:13:45] <MattJ> If you're just creating accounts on the same server, no protocol is really necessary
[16:14:18] <MattJ> Prosody has had a mod_invite for years, I'd be surprised if similar doesn't exist for the other servers
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[16:22:35] <zinid> similar?
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[16:30:15] <MattJ> zinid, https://modules.prosody.im/mod_invite.html
[16:31:05] <zinid> "using an ad-hoc command" - so this requires some protocol after all? given that ad-hoc commands are not rendered by "modern" clients
[16:31:25] <MattJ> A bot could just as easily do it
[16:32:14] <zinid> yes, but a client needs to learn server support somehow?
[16:32:32] <MattJ> No
[16:33:08] <zinid> well, hard to say, there is a very little info on the page
[16:33:13] <MattJ> Ad-hoc commands don't need support, e.g. the way Pidgin renders them is quite nice (and that's possibly the only nice thing about Pidgin's XMPP support)
[16:33:51] <MattJ> If you wanted to do it from a bot instead, you can just interact with that via chat
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[16:34:04] <MattJ> Neither case requires anything particularly special
[16:34:27] <marc> A client should generate an QR code for invitation, how would you do this?
[16:35:56] <poVoq> QR code would be cool in general for connections and MUC invites
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[16:36:22] <poVoq> I guess that's something for the Conversations client though
[16:36:27] <MattJ> marc, the URL can load a QR code or the bot can send one via OOB
[16:36:51] <MattJ> poVoq, yaxim also supports QR code invitations
[16:37:00] <MattJ> Sadly neither are compatible with each other
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[16:38:16] <poVoq> TIL :)
[16:39:22] <MattJ> iirc Conversations uses an xmpp: URI, and yaxim generates a https:// one (so it can be scanned even if you don't have an XMPP app installed yet)
[16:39:53] <marc> Doesn't sound like a good UX
[16:40:06] <MattJ> Which one?
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[16:40:17] <marc> Redirect to a website
[16:40:42] <MattJ> Tried the UX of scanning a Conversations QR code if you don't have Conversations installed?
[16:41:15] <MattJ> and given that most ordinary people *don't* have Conversations installed (yet!), I think it makes sense to cater for that scenario
[16:41:31] <poVoq> 👍
[16:41:54] <poVoq> both would be actually nice
[16:42:37] <MattJ> https:// can work in both scenarios just fine
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[16:44:20] <poVoq> yeah, but that would link to an external server which is both more fail proof and also less privacy
[16:45:32] <marc> Also you want mutual presence subscription
[16:45:57] <MattJ> Hence PARS
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[16:47:57] <marc> Hence a solid protocol for invitations
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[16:48:32] <zinid> Licaon_Kter, regarding that "strange" patch with nesting transaction: it was a fix for regression introduced in c88a2d056968254cdb513d81e133d45484a6236a
[16:48:49] <zinid> Licaon_Kter, `put(?NESTING_KEY, PreviousNestingLevel)` was lost
[16:49:12] <zinid> Licaon_Kter, so we already have 2 related issues in the bugtracker
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[16:50:48] <MattJ> marc, for PARS ideally you need server involvement. My initial comment was simply stating that PARS (nor any fancy protocol) is needed for invitations if the users are being invited to the same server (which is why people are already successfully using it today)
[16:51:14] <MattJ> But... off-topic here, happy to continue the chat elsewhere if wanted
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[16:52:42] <marc> > which is why people are already successfully using it today
I don't use it because there is no ready-to-use code etc. :)
[16:53:07] <MattJ> It's a single line in the config file, etc. :)
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[16:54:31] <marc> At least not in ejabberd :)
[16:54:51] <marc> And there is no adhoc command support in C
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[16:55:10] <marc> So, actually we have nothing?
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[16:55:49] <MattJ> Alright, I'll write the bot this evening while I'm travelling :)
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[17:40:03] <Licaon_Kter> zinid: :)
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[18:40:27] <Steven Roose> is there by default a filter on the allowed filenames in HTTP_Upload?
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[18:40:30] <Steven Roose> (using mod_http_upload)
[18:40:57] <Steven Roose> ah nvm, recipient client error
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[18:56:48] <poVoq> OT: https://github.com/surevine/passport-xmpp another way to auth with XMPP :)
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[19:10:15] <zinid> Holger,
2019-03-15 19:46:50.955 [error] <0.28556.1052>@ejabberd_hooks:safe_apply:384 Hook c2s_unbinded_packet crashed when running mod_stream_mgmt:c2s_unbinded_packet/2:
** Reason = {error,undef,[{undefined,do_encode,[],[timeout,<<"jabber:client">>]},{rfc6120,'-encode_iq/2-lc$^0/1-0-',[{file,"src/rfc6120.erl"},{line,5218}],2},{rfc6120,'-encode_iq/2-lc$^0/1-0-',[{file,"src/rfc6120.erl"},{line,5219}],2},{rfc6120,encode_iq,[{file,"src/rfc6120.erl"},{line,5218}],2},{xmpp_stream_in,socket_send,[{file,"src/xmpp_stream_in.erl"},{line,1175}],2},{xmpp_stream_in,send_pkt,[{file,"src/xmpp_stream_in.erl"},{line,1125}],2},{p1_queue,foldl,[{file,"/usr/src/ejabberd-be/deps/p1_utils/src/p1_queue.erl"},{line,173}],3},{mod_stream_mgmt,handle_resume,[{file,"src/mod_stream_mgmt.erl"},{line,442}],2}]}
...
** Arg 2 = {sm_resume,9,<<"g2gCb....09/s=">>,<<"urn:xmpp:sm:3">>}
[19:10:33] <zinid> Holger, any idea why it calls xmpp:encode(timeout)?
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[19:39:10] <zinid> Holger, somehow `timeout` sneaked into mgmt_queue
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[19:56:01] <zinid> Holger, okay, nevermind, I found it
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