ejabberd - Friday, September 12, 2025

[02:14:23] <zoidberg> usually we create a user, (for the database) lets call it, ejabberd, then we create a database, lets call it also ejabberd, and we give the database ejabberd, to the user ejabberd.
[02:15:01] <zoidberg> Something like that, there was a user not long ago here with sort of the same issues IIRC

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[08:52:26] <Holger> > but it doesn't really say what query it was trying to run when it errored out
Debug level would log all SQL communication. But I guess you could just try to query the table using psql with the same credentials as configured in ejabberd.

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[09:19:24] <zoidberg> Group was shutdown?

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[09:30:32] <Adrien> (A quick server restart 🥹)

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[10:21:42] <s222> Hello everyone.
I ran into problems trying to organize authentication on ejabberd using an external authentication provider (Authentik, Keycloak). Problems arose already at the start, because, as I understand it, ejabberd does not support this. Another problem I noticed in the XMPP ecosystem is the lack of support for convenient external authorization in XMPP mobile clients (that is, there is no such function as in the Element Matrix client, in which you can log in to the web page of an external authentication provider that Element itself opens; well, this was also due to the Synapse Matrix server and its native integration with Element).
My question to you is this: is it possible to set up authentication in ejabberd via external providers (based on OpenID, Kerberos protocols, as an example)? If so, what about user authentication flow on mobile clients?
P.S. I saw in the documentation that it is possible to configure LDAP, but it is not suitable for us due to security requirements.

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[10:27:54] <Kris> Prosody has better support for OIDC including linking to external providers, but indeed the issue is that no xmpp clients support such passwordless logins yet.

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[10:29:17] <Kris> I think there is some code for that in ejabberd as well, but it seems not actively used by anyone and has thus bitrotted.

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[11:02:00] <arut_s2> And what about the situation with mobile clients, what can you say?

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[11:07:39] <Kris> Like I said, the support for it is missing in mobile clients.

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[11:09:12] <Kris> And at least for Conversations it is unlikely to come as I recently discussed it with the main developer and external authentification conflicts with the channel binding security feature that the dev wants to prioritize.
[11:10:10] <Kris> But they seemed open to suggestions how to combine the two.

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[11:10:59] <Kris> (But based on discussions with the Prosody devs, I sadly assume these two features are fundamentally incompatible).

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[11:11:55] <Kris> (I am not an expert on this at all though)
[11:12:18] <zoidberg> Well, if there is interested from companies they can just hire people from server and client side and make it happen.

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[11:16:31] <Kris> Sure

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[12:05:54] <arut_s2> Got it, *thanks* for the valuable information.
You are a great community ❤️
[12:06:14] <arut_s2> Got it, thanks for the valuable information.
You are a great community ❤️
[12:06:22] <arut_s2> Got it, Thanks for the valuable information.
You are a great community ❤️

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[12:11:54] <zoidberg> H olger your avatar is behaving quite strangely on this room. I can see an H here on the chat, i can see your picture on the chat details, and if i click on "view participants" its back to an H
[12:12:36] <zoidberg> i am like 99.999% sure that there is an avatar bug recently introduced on the conversations side.
[12:13:35] <zoidberg> I could maybe check for conversations logs, but it will probably be the "could not fetch avatar for..."

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[12:17:28] <zoidberg> https://share.conversations.im/zoidberg/message/NM9SoaOzIp9KXVHn/ZBR5IqWPRnezBdvjiBiZhw.jpg
[12:17:28] <zoidberg> https://share.conversations.im/zoidberg/message/RJh4YdhoW5xI8eVF/0nTILXraTwCPqOGVCI7EHg.jpg
[12:17:29] <zoidberg> https://share.conversations.im/zoidberg/message/WwW5aPuy9mVLbuWX/X4ku-p2QRgyZxtDFhFf7dQ.jpg
[12:17:53] <zoidberg> Images just to illustrate.

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[12:36:23] <arut_s2> > And at least for Conversations it is unlikely to come as I recently discussed it with the main developer and external authentification conflicts with the channel binding security feature that the dev wants to prioritize.
By the way, may I ask for links to the discussions you mentioned with the Conversations developer and the Prosody developer discussion? (Unless, of course, these are personal discussions.)
It would be very helpful in further studying the problem, thank you.
[12:36:49] <arut_s2> > And at least for Conversations it is unlikely to come as I recently discussed it with the main developer and external authentification conflicts with the channel binding security feature that the dev wants to prioritize.
By the way, may I ask for links to the discussions you mentioned with the Conversations developer and the Prosody developer discussion? (Unless, of course, these are personal discussions.)
It would be very helpful in further studying the problem, Thank you.

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[13:09:56] <Kris> the public part happend here: https://indieweb.social/@joinjabber/115135829037892366

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[13:10:47] <Kris> Daniel is the main Conversations developer and Zash is part of the Prosody team.
[13:11:17] <Kris> and Zash is AFAIK the one that worked on the improved OIDC support in Prosody lately

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[14:01:13] <ademir> > Got it, Thanks for the valuable information.
> You are a great community ❤️
❤️

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[14:13:13] <ray_cist> Guys, I'm planning to run a XMPP server with potentially 10 thousand users. What would be the most lightweight server software I sould run? I currently run Ejabberd latest version on the $6 cheapest Digital Ocean Droplet. I can afford expensive vps I just want to know which server software is the lightest. Perhaps someone knows real life friends or popular servers that run on very low powered hardware, comparatively speaking.

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[14:14:44] <ray_cist> Also, does Movim run on Ejabberd mostly?
[14:14:58] <Kris> ejabberd will be the best for that number of users as it scales better
[14:15:12] <Kris> Prosody is more lightweight at smaller number of users though
[14:15:22] <ray_cist> oh
[14:15:35] <Kris> Movim works with both Ejabberd and Prosody, but it is better tested with Ejabberd

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[14:17:24] <ray_cist> Kris, Thank you for the insight. Just wondering if you know approximately what kind of hardware this feat will reqiure? vCPUs, ram and storage wise
[14:17:43] <ray_cist> I'm pretty new to XMPP

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[14:19:18] <Kris> hard to say, depends on the usage pattern and a lot of other things. Especially storage for image uploads also depends on your config on how long to retain them and what you allow people to upload.

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[14:19:53] <Kris> but it shouldn't be too bad. a 4 core, 8gb ram VPS can probably do 10k users
[14:20:09] <ray_cist> > but it shouldn't be too bad. a 4 core, 8gb ram VPS can probably do 10k users
Holy shit really?
[14:20:17] <ray_cist> is XMPP this lightweight?
[14:20:24] <Kris> yes
[14:20:33] <ray_cist> My god, this is the future
[14:20:35] <ray_cist> lol

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[14:20:59] <ray_cist> Thank you Kris,

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[14:24:06] <Kris> note: this is for Ejabberd. For Movim you might need more RAM.

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[14:24:43] <Kris> not entirely sure how much RAM Movim needs per connected user.

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[14:26:20] <ray_cist> > note: this is for Ejabberd. For Movim you might need more RAM.
Yes, Ejabberd seems like the best option for this
[14:26:45] <ray_cist> Kris, you seem to have much experience with ejabberd

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[14:27:02] <ademir> > My god, this is the future
Awesome, right?!
[14:27:21] <Kris> not that much, but I am running a instance with a few hundred users since a while.
[14:27:40] <ray_cist> > Awesome, right?!
This is beyond awesome my friend, I was thinking I would go bankrupt serving 10k users but this is sooooo goood!!
[14:27:47] <Kris> no where near 10k, but I can make some educated guesses

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[14:28:09] <ray_cist> > not that much, but I am running a instance with a few hundred users since a while.
Interesting

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[14:38:52] <Moncho> Hi guys, I am running my own ejabberd instance but my only current problem is, I can't find an iOS client that works. Does someone have any suggestions on that front? Either config side or an app
[14:39:10] <ray_cist> > Hi guys, I am running my own ejabberd instance but my only current problem is, I can't find an iOS client that works. Does someone have any suggestions on that front? Either config side or an app
Monal?
[14:39:17] <zoidberg> I hear Monal is the best one.

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[14:39:41] <ray_cist> > Hi guys, I am running my own ejabberd instance but my only current problem is, I can't find an iOS client that works. Does someone have any suggestions on that front? Either config side or an app
https://monal-im.org/

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[14:41:17] <Kris> https://joinjabber.org/docs/apps/ios/
[14:41:26] <Kris> mentions the options
[14:41:44] <Kris> but iOS is not the best supported platform tbh

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[14:47:40] <Slava Bendersky> I am trying configure sqlite for small setup, how I can specify path. Seems like not match info in docs

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[15:18:30] <ademir> Here’s a clearer version you can drop into the ejabberd chatroom:
---
**Question:**
I’d like to know if the following YAML structure would be valid in `ejabberd.yml`. Specifically, can I use `append_host_config` in this way to define per-domain settings?
```yaml
append_host_config:
  "domain1.tld":
  "domain3.tld":
    default_db: sql
    sql_type: pgsql
    sql_server: "localhost"
    sql_database: "ejabberd_domain1"
  "domain2.tld":
    default_db: mnesia
```
[15:18:37] ademir retracted a previous message, but it's unsupported by your client.
[15:18:48] <ademir> I’d like to know if the following YAML structure would be valid in `ejabberd.yml`. Specifically, can I use `append_host_config` in this way to define per-domain settings?
```yaml
append_host_config:
  "domain1.tld":
  "domain3.tld":
    default_db: sql
    sql_type: pgsql
    sql_server: "localhost"
    sql_database: "ejabberd_domain1"
  "domain2.tld":
    default_db: mnesia
```
Or is `append_host_config` only available as an Erlang function / RPC call, and I should instead use `host_config` in the YAML config file?
[15:19:13] <ademir> I’d like to know if the following YAML structure would be valid in `ejabberd.yml`. Specifically, can I use `append_host_config` in this way to define per-domain settings?
```yaml
append_host_config:
  "domain1.tld":
  "domain3.tld":
    default_db: sql
    sql_type: pgsql
    sql_server: "localhost"
    sql_database: "ejabberd_domain1"
  "domain2.tld":
    default_db: mnesia
```

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[15:48:20] <ademir> or something similar that doesnt make me to copy and paste the same settings for domain 1 and 3?

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[16:14:04] <Kris> afaik no, you need to duplicate it

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[16:16:11] <ademir> it is not only that it is extra work to replicate, but also when I need to update some settings I often forget to change for the domain 3.
Maybe anchor is allowed?
something like
```yaml
x-common-sql: &common-sql
  default_db: sql
  sql_type: pgsql
  sql_server: "localhost"
  sql_database: "ejabberd_domain1"
append_host_config:
  "domain1.tld": *common-sql
  "domain3.tld": *common-sql
  "domain2.tld":
    default_db: mnesia
```
[16:16:11] <prefiks> ademir: you probably could use macros, osmething like:
define_macro:
   COMMON_CONFIG:
      default_db: sql
      ...
append_host_config:
  "domain1": COMMON_CONFIG
  "domain2: "COMMON_CONFIG
[16:16:29] <ademir> > ademir: you probably could use macros, osmething like:
> define_macro:
>    COMMON_CONFIG:
>       default_db: sql
>       ...
> append_host_config:
>   "domain1": COMMON_CONFIG
>   "domain2: "COMMON_CONFIG
this is great, thanks!
[16:17:12] <prefiks> See https://github.com/processone/ejabberd/blob/master/test/ejabberd_SUITE_data/ejabberd.mnesia.yml and https://github.com/processone/ejabberd/blob/master/test/ejabberd_SUITE_data/ejabberd.yml

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[16:18:11] <Moncho> >> Hi guys, I am running my own ejabberd instance but my only current problem is, I can't find an iOS client that works. Does someone have any suggestions on that front? Either config side or an app
> Monal?
Does monal need a specific special config to be able to connect? I tried but it times out

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[16:21:45] <zoidberg> Does your server run on custom ports?
[16:22:15] <zoidberg> do you see the client trying to connect via your ejabberd logs?
[16:22:21] <prefiks> do you see any messages in ejabberd logs about there being attempts to connect?

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[17:02:01] <Kris> Moncho, ah, do you use some external auth or so?

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[17:02:57] <Kris> you can go to the advanced connection settings and enable the "Allow MITM-prone PLAIN auth..." setting and then it should work. In case that still fails, try removing the account from Monal completely and start again.

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[17:10:27] <moparisthebest> ray_cist: benchmark for 10k users, rtb is a good choice
my wild guess is that ejabberd will handle it no sweat and you'll never get movim to handle it without dozens of servers and a load balancing setup from hell... Are you sure you need movim and not something like converse.js?
[17:10:49] <Moncho> > Does your server run on custom ports?
Not custom ports, the default ones
[17:11:16] <Moncho> > Moncho, ah, do you use some external auth or so?
Nope, simple auth, I can connect using gajim and conversations with no problem

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[17:11:53] <Moncho> > you can go to the advanced connection settings and enable the "Allow MITM-prone PLAIN auth..." setting and then it should work. In case that still fails, try removing the account from Monal completely and start again.
Okok, I'll test this and also watch in my logs the connection attempts, thanks

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[17:22:06] <Kris> moparisthebest, Movim is actually quite efficient. But yes it needs a few mb RAM per connected user

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[17:23:31] <moparisthebest> I can't imagine a server actually running 10k separate long lived php processes while also running ejabberd and servicing all the php requests for the front end

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[17:24:16] <moparisthebest> I'm not saying it's impossible, just seems unlikely to me is all... Benchmark benchmark benchmark :)

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[17:28:27] <Kris> Facebook is written in php 🤷

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[17:29:06] <Kris> but yeah I don't think Movim has ever been tested with that many users

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[17:29:39] <moparisthebest> yea... which they accomplish with their tens of thousands of engineers and a custom php to c++ compiler and a ton of other things...

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[17:30:38] <Kris> also 5 orders of magnitude more users

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[17:34:47] <moparisthebest> all I'm saying is I'm confident both prosody (with fast enough single core) and ejabberd will handle 10k users (I've benchmarked https://github.com/moparisthebest/xmpp-bench-proxy ) but I'm not confident at all that movim can /shrug

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[17:38:40] <Kris> well, I don't disagree, but I think you would be surprised at how many users Movim can easily handle

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[18:05:37] <Slava Bendersky> I am getting this error
ejabberd HTTP handler crashed: exception error: {module_not_loaded,mod_conversejs,}
[18:05:50] <Slava Bendersky> But configuration in config file

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[18:06:13] <Slava Bendersky> is there are any dependency modules which is might required

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[18:16:27] <Slava Bendersky> 25.08

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[18:30:48] <Slava Bendersky> I found the issue
[18:31:22] <Slava Bendersky> I have to host own version of converse client

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[18:38:21] <Moncho> Is there a problem on changing the app config from using starttls to just tls? Instead of the allow mitm-prone plain auth? For modal I mean

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[19:18:10] <Kris> Moncho, this has nothing to do with starttls or tls
[19:18:32] <Kris> plain auth is also TLS encrypted either way

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[19:19:41] <Kris> but if for some reason that TLS chain gets broken via an MITM attack then the attacker can read the password in plaintext.
[19:20:37] <Kris> it is a valid concern, but that Monal refuses to connect by default when plain auth is used it imho a bit over the top.

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[19:21:37] <moparisthebest> especially when TLS 1.2 channel binding provides 0 protection over not doing it at all lol

[19:23:25] Sergio leaves the room

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[20:21:00] gooya leaves the room: Disconnected: Replaced by new connection

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[20:47:27] deimosBSD leaves the room: Disconnected: Received SIGTERM

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[20:53:53] deimosBSD leaves the room: Disconnected: Received SIGTERM

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