Process-one
ejabberd
ejabberd@conference.process-one.net
Saturday, September 8, 2018< ^ >
zinid has set the subject to: ejabberd discussions: https://docs.ejabberd.im
Room Configuration
Room Occupants

GMT+0
[00:09:31] chrys leaves the room: Machine going to sleep
[00:13:45] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[00:15:10] lorddavidiii leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[00:15:39] lorddavidiii leaves the room: Connection failed: connection closed
[00:23:26] jeremy leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
[00:46:35] jeremy leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[02:08:10] daniel leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[02:44:46] pprrks leaves the room: Disconnected: Replaced by new connection
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[03:57:17] chrys leaves the room
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[04:09:16] marc leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
[04:09:19] Licaon_Kter leaves the room
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[04:25:40] jere leaves the room
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[04:32:35] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[04:34:33] joekokker leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[04:35:46] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[05:11:31] lorddavidiii leaves the room: Connection failed: connection closed
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[05:59:04] <zinid> the XEP is terrible anyway
[06:02:35] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[06:04:05] Dominik Paulus leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[06:55:41] ta leaves the room: Machine going to sleep
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[06:56:14] ta leaves the room: Machine going to sleep
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[07:01:12] daniel leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
[07:01:19] pod leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[07:05:20] Man_Life leaves the room
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[07:12:22] rom1dep leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[07:36:59] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[07:45:11] robert_mobil leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[07:47:25] aditya_borikar leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
[07:48:02] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[07:49:17] UsL leaves the room: Disconnected: Replaced by new connection
[07:50:23] edhelas leaves the room: Connection failed: connection closed
[07:51:55] madmalkav leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[07:53:18] Licaon_Kter leaves the room
[07:54:04] Dominik Paulus leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[07:57:10] paul leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
[07:59:08] <flow> I tried to read https://github.com/processone/ejabberd/blob/master/src/mod_ping.erl, but my erlang-foo is not strong enough. I wanted to find out if mod_ping is smart about its pings, i.e. if it only pings after X time of inactivity
[07:59:35] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[08:02:27] fuvuv leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
[08:02:35] alexis leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[08:28:31] adrien leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[08:44:50] debalance leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[08:45:37] <zinid> flow, the timer is restarted every time the server receives a packet from the user's stream
[08:46:39] adrien leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
[08:46:50] <zinid> https://github.com/processone/ejabberd/blob/master/src/mod_ping.erl#L230-L233
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[08:48:12] <zinid> damn, something is wrong with the indentation
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[08:51:59] zuglufttier leaves the room: Machine going to sleep
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[09:14:28] spicewiesel leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[09:25:03] marek leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[10:10:53] bammes leaves the room: Rechner geht in den Ruhezustand
[10:11:31] daniel leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[10:25:19] jannic leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[10:33:24] Andrew Nenakhov leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[10:41:23] mightyBroccoli leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
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[10:54:20] rom1dep leaves the room: Machine going to sleep
[10:55:55] <flow> uh, does the jid:tolower means that JIDs are not normalized in ejabberd?
[10:56:22] <flow> zinid, thanks, that is sensible, i wonder if the timer should also reset when a stanza is send
[10:58:13] UsL leaves the room
[10:58:51] <zinid> flow: it is normalized, it's just jid 'object' holds both representations, and jid:tolower() is asking for normalized one
[10:59:22] <zinid> flow: no, only when received
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[12:09:19] <genofire> !version mailbox.org
[12:09:19] <Servant> genofire: mailbox.org is running Prosody version 0.10 nightly build 489 (2018-06-10, 144666d0ad2f) on Linux
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[12:35:10] <flow> zinid, Holger: I'm again working on Smack's core connection logic and need to increase ejabberd's pre-auth connection inactivity timeout for debugging purposes. IIRC it was hardcoded in older versions but became configurable in new onces. What do I have to change again?
[12:35:22] Dominik Paulus leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Replaced by new connection (conflict)
[12:35:30] 404 leaves the room: Stream closed by us: Timed out waiting for stream resumption (connection-timeout)
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[12:46:50] <zuglufttier> Does anybody know what some of the bigger xmpp instances use in terms of hardware?
[12:47:41] deavmi leaves the room
[12:47:42] <zuglufttier> People tell me XMPP would need as much resources as Matrix if there are some more people online.
[12:47:48] bammes leaves the room
[12:48:00] <zuglufttier> So, are there some numbers online?
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[12:52:20] <zuglufttier> Like jabber.at for example?
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[13:01:57] <Holger> flow: "negotiation_timeout: 300".  It's a global option, the timeout is in seconds.
[13:02:18] <Holger> zuglufttier: Well jabber.at has a few thousand online users, I guess that's too small to be interesting.
[13:02:37] <Holger> Maybe zinid's benchmarks?
[13:03:19] <Holger> Of course they're somewhat artifical, but his new tool at least tries to mimic real-world behavior to some degree.
[13:03:36] <zuglufttier> Since prosody seems to struggle with that amount of users, see trashserver.net, I'd like to know how Matrix would behave on such a hardware.
[13:04:19] <Link Mauve> zuglufttier, AFAIK it isn’t related to the number of users, but to some bad community modules being enabled.
[13:04:53] <zinid> zuglufttier: well, Matrix doesn't scale neither vertically nor horizontally, so who cares 😁
[13:05:09] <zuglufttier> zinid, I want to prove people on the internet wrong.
[13:05:10] <flow> Holger, do you know if it is availabe in 17.04?
[13:05:10] <zuglufttier> :D
[13:05:39] <Holger> zuglufttier: Either way it's of course hard to distinguish protocol-specific limitations from implementation-specific limitations.  If you compare Synapse to ejabberd and make conclusions regarding the protocol it would be that's somewhat unfair against Matrix I guess :-)
[13:05:52] <Holger> s/that's//
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[13:07:35] <zinid> Holger: btw, I compared 3 Java mqtt implementations with 3 Erlang mqtt implementations and concluded that Java is shit 😁 Am I wrong?
[13:08:02] <zinid> Is 3 enough number? 🤔
[13:08:55] <Holger> flow: Nope, you need 18.03 or newer.
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[13:10:00] <Holger> zinid: For discussions on the Internet, that's more than enough.
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[13:10:45] <flow> Holger, you don't happen to be able to provide me a patch against 17.04 that increases the negotiation timeout for c2s to 15 minutes?
[13:11:20] <flow> or at least point me to the magic number in src/ejabberd_c2s.erl that I've to change?
[13:11:44] <Holger> Yes I can do that, but not right now sorry.
[13:12:04] <flow> Holger, k, thanks, I'll remind you later ;)
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[13:16:43] <zinid> flow: it's in xmpp_stream_in.erl
[13:16:52] <zinid> flow: grep '30'
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[13:20:34] <zinid> Link Mauve:
> zuglufttier, AFAIK it isn’t related to the number of users, but to some bad community modules being enabled.
That's a strange excuse, because Prosody  is half community modules and as I understand this is intended by design 😁
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[13:21:21] <Link Mauve> zinid, not really.
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[13:21:38] <flow> zinid, thanks
[13:22:15] <zinid> Link Mauve: any new functionality is in 3rd party modules, such as CSI, http upload
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[13:23:01] <zinid> Anyway, in my tests Prosody behaved correctly, it's just doesn't scale, but this is definitely by design (Lua)
[13:23:07] <Link Mauve> zinid, yes, until it can be included in Prosody itself, because it’s had enough testing, or proved to be a bad idea and get rewritten.
[13:24:12] <flow> zinid, any ideas what the bottleneck is?
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[13:24:33] <Link Mauve> flow, single-threaded TLS handshakes would be my first guess.
[13:24:38] <zinid> flow: in Prosody? Single CPU core of course
[13:24:45] <Link Mauve> It is our c2s bottleneck at JabberFR when we restart Prosody.
[13:24:52] <Link Mauve> c2s and s2s actually.
[13:24:56] <zinid> Link Mauve: I tested with and without tls
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[13:25:09] <Link Mauve> Oh, I didn’t remember that.
[13:25:26] <flow> so prosody is completely single threaded?
[13:25:32] <flow> Or just some parts?
[13:25:33] <zinid> Without tls it's just able to handle more, but single core still a bottle neck
[13:25:54] <Link Mauve> flow, completely, except if you include external things such as a TLS-aware proxy.
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[13:26:24] <flow> no locks, yeah :)
[13:26:37] <flow> but well yes, then the comparision is not really fair
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[13:26:46] <Link Mauve> Doesn’t need to be. :)
[13:27:03] <flow> Sure, I also see the advantages of a pure single threaded design
[13:27:06] <zinid> Not TLS offload worth it, until you have very slow hardware for Prosody
[13:27:07] <Link Mauve> When people are looking for an XMPP server, this should be taken into account for their decision.
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[13:27:35] <Link Mauve> zinid, doing it in a multi-threaded proxy sounds definitely worth it though.
[13:27:46] <flow> I think most personal XMPP services are happy with a pure single threaded server, if they are only hosting a few accounts
[13:28:00] <zinid> Link Mauve: but the bottle neck still there
[13:28:03] <Link Mauve> flow, indeed.
[13:28:13] <Link Mauve> flow, but those deployments don’t need to care about those benchmarks.
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[13:28:43] <Link Mauve> You don’t need a server able to scale to 2.5M online users if all you have are six users.
[13:28:57] <flow> Link Mauve, course
[13:29:22] <Link Mauve> Same if you have 1000 online users.
[13:29:25] <flow> hmm damn ejabberd is still 17.04 in gentoo
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[13:29:46] <flow> but at least my user patch setting the timeout to 15min was applied, let's see if it works
[13:31:01] <zinid> flow: compile from sources, it's not for production anyway
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[14:06:31] <zinid> btw, if the guy from trashserver.net provides his prosody configuration I can try to stress test it
[14:06:34] <flow> zinid, that is basically what I'm doing, using gentoo
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[14:19:38] <nico> zinid, is it possible to move from old sql to new sql without restarting the node?
[14:21:56] <zinid> nico, no, actually the converter is broken in the current release
[14:23:14] <nico> hmm ok that means I would have to convert the msql db manually, I think I will not do that 😀
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[14:23:40] <zinid> nico, wait a couple of months, I'm going to fix this, this is top priority
[14:24:42] <nico> sure no problem there is no hurry for me on this 🙂 but thank you thats awesome 🙂
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[14:37:44] <jr> Hello, I set up ejabber with sqlite but now the service wont start anymore...
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[14:39:03] <jr> It says failed to start application 'sqlite3'
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[14:43:30] <Holger> jr: How did you install ejabberd?
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[14:44:09] <jr> over apt
[14:44:10] <Holger> jr: I mean as a distribution package (what distribution) or using a package from process-one.net or from source?
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[14:44:29] <Holger> jr: apt install erlang-p1-sqlite3
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[14:44:35] <jr> I use the distribution package for raspbian
[14:44:49] <jr> Thats it?
[14:44:54] <Holger> Try :-)
[14:45:00] <jr> Ok
[14:48:31] <jr> Holger: Works, thank you
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[14:49:30] <Holger> 👍
[14:50:34] <404> nico use postgresql
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[14:53:35] <404> nico, oops it looks like you already have mysql
[14:55:55] <mightyBroccoli> 404: correct. And I will not move all my dbs to postgres when I can just wait for the converter.
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[15:14:30] <nico> zinid the guy from trashserver.net is the one you ranted about for waiting on jackal 😀 isnt it?
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[15:26:35] <Licaon_Kter> nico:  but he is waiting, or started ranting that he is after some mysterious bugs kept his 6500 users from being online.
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[15:30:30] <Licaon_Kter> nico: you're NicoAlt?
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[15:37:57] <nico> NicoAlt?
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[15:43:45] <Licaon_Kter> nico: so no, 😋
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[18:52:47] <zinid> nico, yes, he is ;)
[18:53:02] <zinid> given how slow jackal development is, he will migrate by 2045
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[18:54:34] <zinid> also, in benchmarks I didn't notice exceptional jackal performance, there are already design mistakes, e.g. database misuse
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[18:55:30] <zinid> after they implement all the compliance suite in jackal it will be slower than ejabberd, I gurarantee that
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[18:58:06] <daniel> It seems the reason for jackal is 'prosody is slow but I don't like erlang'
[18:58:44] <daniel> So the interesting question in the end won't be will it be faster than ejabberd but will it be faster than prosody
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[18:59:32] <zinid> and prosody is not slower than ejabberd btw, strictly speaking, if we compare single core performance
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[19:00:19] <Licaon_Kter> daniel:
> It seems the reason for jackal is 'prosody is slow but I don't like erlang'
Those were his exact words actually 😐
[19:01:42] <zinid> well, at least Go has multi-core scheduler, unlike lua ;)
[19:02:11] <zinid> that's the only advantage of Go I see, other stuff sucks as fuck, like a language from '70
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[19:02:54] <zinid> Rust is much more advanced in this regard, and you can write a scheduler for it if needed
[19:03:03] <zinid> well, at least I can :)
[19:03:55] <Licaon_Kter> So it will have multicore or not on Go?
[19:04:09] <zinid> on Go?
[19:04:23] <zinid> I didn't understand, sorry
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[19:09:13] <Licaon_Kter> Jackal I mean, has an avantange over Lua?
[19:09:21] <Licaon_Kter> *multithreading
[19:11:10] <zinid> yes
[19:11:54] <zinid> also native compiler vs bytecode
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[21:36:14] <genofire> !version protonlab.org
[21:36:17] <Servant> genofire: protonlab.org is running Prosody version 0.9.12 on Linux
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[21:39:52] <genofire> I just do not like the philosoph of jackel hardcoded mysql - golang has SQL interface and also really nice orm's
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[21:42:11] <genofire> By the way, I have started to read a lot of xep's and create go structs for it (and a little golang dirty client lib - on a try of server there run my time away) https://github.com/genofire/yaja/tree/master/xmpp
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[21:56:36] <zinid> genofire, you're doing by hands the stuff which is made automatically in ejabberd, see https://github.com/processone/xmpp
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[22:04:49] <genofire> zinid: somethings jey at many places is still https://github.com/genofire/yaja/blob/0ad62245e8cf44e41f062cc6562614de79fea902/xmpp/client_iq.go#L30 - i just hate some go alternatives which mostly write strings in quellcode https://github.com/mattn/go-xmpp/blob/e543ad3fcd51155e4b39f7487bdfcb5e3772f1ce/xmpp.go#L686
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[22:05:28] <genofire> (Just want a little lib for a grafana alert bot ;D )
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[22:17:34] <jr> Hey I got this error with http upload: [error] <0.630.0>@mod_http_upload:init:307 Cannot find 'identify' command, please install ImageMagick or disable thumbnail creation
[22:18:10] <jr> What package I have to install on my raspbian system for that?
[22:18:31] <Licaon_Kter> jr: what ejabberd version?
[22:18:43] <Licaon_Kter> How did you install?
[22:18:51] <jr> 16.09
[22:18:59] <Licaon_Kter> why?
[22:19:07] <jr> Licaon_Kter‎: from apt
[22:19:18] <Licaon_Kter> Isn't a newer version in Raspbian ?
[22:19:33] <jr> No I dont think so
[22:19:48] <Licaon_Kter> What RPi version? 1?2?3?
[22:19:55] <jr> Not in the official package source
[22:19:58] <jr> RPI 3
[22:20:17] <Licaon_Kter> Add Debian backports and get 18.06 from there
[22:20:20] <Licaon_Kter> *repo
[22:20:35] <jr> That works?
[22:20:50] <Licaon_Kter> https://packages.debian.org/stretch-backports/ejabberd
[22:20:54] <Licaon_Kter> it should afaik
[22:21:37] <Licaon_Kter> Or build it, it takes 10mins on my RPi1, it should be faster on yours.
[22:22:12] <Licaon_Kter> ( with Erlang 20.x.x from `testing` 😉 )
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[22:32:12] <jr> I will try to use the backports
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[22:57:40] <jr> Licaon_Kter‎: now that works but im getting SQL query 'Q28704464' at {ejabberd_auth_sql,162} failed: "attempt to write a readonly database"
[22:58:03] <jr> Wich permission i have to set for the sqlite file?
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[23:01:09] <Licaon_Kter> jr: user/group `ejabberd` right? perms 755 should be ok
[23:01:48] <jr> Ok
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[23:10:25] <jr> Licaon_Kter: still getting the error
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[23:15:55] <Licaon_Kter> How do you start it?
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[23:19:46] <jr> The Server?
[23:19:53] <jr> Over the service
[23:20:12] <jr> So just 'sudo systemctl start ejabberd'
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[23:22:50] <Licaon_Kter> and the folders permissions are ok? /var/lib/ejabberd ? Not sure where your install tries to setup the database.
[23:23:47] <jr> Oh to what I have to set the permission for the Folter?
[23:23:54] <jr> * folder
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[23:24:26] <Licaon_Kter> ejabberd:ejabberd of course
[23:24:35] <jr> Ok
[23:27:09] <jr> Still appearing
[23:27:22] <Licaon_Kter> no idea then 🤷
[23:27:40] <jr> But I think I will trie it again tomorrow, im so sleepy xD
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