Process-one
ejabberd
ejabberd@conference.process-one.net
Tuesday, May 19, 2020< ^ >
zinid has set the subject to: ejabberd discussions: https://docs.ejabberd.im
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[00:36:18] <Alacer> Related to the SRV records as per mfoss if we configure _stuns/_turns to be 443 rather 5349 and announce the same in mod_stun_disco it will work through NAT but then it will always use 443. I assume we run sslh for ejabberd where liatener is 5349 but SSLH routes it to 5349.  Is this OK ?
We can also run coturn with 443 as tls-listening-port and doing same with SRVs..What is the advantage of 5349 vs 443 through sslh besides CPU/Memory usage on server and May be throughput
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[01:31:11] <justatest> Also the conversations is the newest version too up there
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[05:45:37] <Holger> justatest: I could give you a tcpdump command to run to grab a dump and I'll have a look at it if you like.
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[05:54:17] <Holger> Alacer: I still didn't check whether TURNS traffic can be detected by sslh.
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[05:58:46] <Licaon_Kter> Maybe it's a different keyword/regex
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtcweb-alpn-04#section-2
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[06:00:18] <Alacer> Holger: I have ran it actually. It worked with SSLH and Conv 2.8.2 for me on a cloud VPS... but Licaon_Kter could have it. In SSLH I used TLS but then SNI in sslh for the domain that was announced in Mod Stun Disco. I just changed port from 5349 to 44 in Disco and open the UDP/TCP Port Range... It passed NAT even CG-NAT / Proxies...
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[06:01:04] <Holger> Alacer: Ok.
[06:01:53] <Holger> Licaon_Kter: I'll check with tcpdump later. Getting tired of responding with "dunno".
[06:02:00] <Alacer> Holger: SSLH does not detect TURNs so its just to fiddle with SNI. and this is applicable for Ejabberd Stun for coturn i used another VPS with Tls Listening port 443 and same announce 443 on Mod Stun Disco for.the URLnof cotun server
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[06:02:22] <Holger> Alacer: So what's the question?
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[06:04:58] <Alacer> The actual Question is that I had jsut 2/3 Users what is the impact of The SSLH passed TURN Traffic on actual Throughput and CPU/Memory Consup. I was surprised that CPU was Like 1-2 % used or spike to 5% ... So if we do not announce 5349 it is Ok then or without 5349 we get more Throughput but No NAT/Proxy Pass...
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[06:08:34] <Holger> Alacer: sslh doesn't scale well to thousands of connections, but for a smaller number of contentions I would not expect you notice any difference.
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[06:08:54] <Holger> Alacer: sslh doesn't scale well to thousands of parallel connections, but for a smaller number of connections I would not expect you notice any difference.
[06:08:59] <Ellenor Malik> bosh might
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[06:11:59] <Alacer> Thanks...
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[06:14:27] <Alacer> So the for 433 we may need coturn on another server currently ? I am little interested to see how Blabber.im does it as its a public server and they are using ejabbers stun but I have not tested them. from here in GCC i have check my own setup, Conv.im and/or Mesaaging.one.. All works
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[06:15:28] <Holger> Alacer, not sure what the difference in Coturn vs. ejabberd TURN would be in regard to running on 443.
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[06:16:11] <Holger> Alacer, you want to avoid sslh?
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[06:18:20] <Holger> Alacer, maybe Coturn allows you to listen on 443 if started with root privileges (and then drops them), I dunno.  You could allow `beam.smp`to listen on 443 by using `setcap` to add the `CAP_NET_BIND_SERVICE` capability.  But you'd have to re-set that when Erlang is updated so it's probably easier to use Coturn if that just works, yes.
[06:18:24] <Alacer> Nope I am looking to lets say use ejabberd_stun in cluster so sslh is like reverse proxy for me in test. Later on HA Proxy or similar to look at..
[06:18:56] <Holger> Then I'm back to not understanding how this is related to "Coturn vs. ejabberd TURN".
[06:19:45] <Holger> In a cluster you would typically just have `mod_stun_disco` point to the TURN server running on the local node.
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[06:20:14] <Holger> Well dunno about "typically" but that would be the easiest setup.
[06:20:25] <Alacer> Its not coturn vs Turn... its just 5349 vs 443 .. Leave it let me test and probably share so it makes it clear to understand the scenario...
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[06:20:53] <Alacer> > Holger Wrote:
> Well dunno about "typically" but that would be the easiest setup.
Yup Agree..
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[08:24:19] <mfoss> justatest: you say your server is behind a nat with dmz. does that mean your server is on your local network behind a wifi router given by an ISP?
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[09:49:38] <sepiol> Hi. I am currently migrating my ejabberd server from 18.12 to 20.04. When I try to import the backup file, I get the following error message:
Error: table_not_exists
Can't restore backup from "/var/spool/ejabberd/ejabberd.backup" at node ejabberd@localhost: Table acl does not exist.
Can someone tell me what I have to do now? I am using the Mnesia database.
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[10:07:26] <Holger> sepiol: I'd try just copying over the Mnesia files as-is rather than backup/restore.  Mnesia schema changes are then auto-applied, while they won't be with backup/restore,
[10:08:21] <sepiol> I have already read [0], but unfortunately I still don't know exactly what I have to do. Just copy the whole directory? The upgrade notes do not show any special requirements for mnesia.
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[10:08:31] <sepiol> [0] https://docs.ejabberd.im/admin/upgrade/
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[10:09:11] <sepiol> Holger, which are the mnesia files? Everything in the .../lib/ejabberd/ directory?
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[10:09:43] <Holger> sepiol: The /upgrade/ notes are meant for SQL users, Mnesia stuff will be auto-upgraded.
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[10:09:48] <Holger> sepiol: Yes sounds right.
[10:10:03] <Holger> sepiol: Nevertheless it's strongly recommended to switch to SQL, at least for MAM/PubSub.
[10:10:21] <sepiol> Okay, i'll give it a try. Thanks!
[10:10:42] <Holger> sepiol: Mnesia isn't really designed for persistent storage of non-trivial amounts of data.  It's nice to get things going out of the box, but not a good solution for production usw.
[10:10:46] <Holger> *use
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[11:00:35] <sepiol> Everything worked out perfectly. Thanks a lot, Holger!
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[11:47:29] <zuglufttier> Is there a reason why someone would build ejabberd without STUN/TURN support?
These are the default options for the FreeBSD Port:
     DOCS=on: Build and/or install documentation
     FULLXML=off: Full XML support
     MYSQL=off: MySQL database support
     ODBC=off: ODBC database backend
     PAM=off: Pluggable authentication module support
     PGSQL=off: PostgreSQL database support
     REDIS=off: Redis key-value store database support
     SIP=off: SIP support
     SQLITE=off: SQLite database support
     STUN=off: STUN/TURN support
     TOOLS=off: Build development tools
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[11:49:02] <zuglufttier> I'd like to see STUN/TURN enabled by default in the package. Also, support for MySQL und PostgresSQL have to be enabled as well.
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[11:59:30] <Holger> zuglufttier, debalance now enabled STUN/TURN by default (i.e. made it a hard dependency) in the ejabberd package, FWIW.
[11:59:42] <Holger> I see no reason not to do that.
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[12:01:55] <zuglufttier> OK, I'll tell the maintainer about that. But what about the databases? Are there any downsides to enable the support? Will that drag in other packages?
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[12:02:03] <debalance> in Debian more or less all of the above is enabled, but not all modules are hard-dependencies in the package, giving the admin the ability to choose
[12:02:34] <debalance> but I guess for FreeBSD ports that approach is not viable
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[12:04:03] <zuglufttier> Hm, I see... Thanks anyway! I'll look up how this is supposed to work on FreeBSD. There must be some kind of eqivalent ;)
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[12:22:33] <justatest> > justatest: I could give you a tcpdump command to run to grab a dump and I'll have a look at it if you like.
Yes that would be great
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[12:24:08] <justatest> > justatest: you say your server is behind a nat with dmz. does that mean your server is on your local network behind a wifi router given by an ISP?
Yes that's the test one. The other one I'd also behind a nat but it's on lan and fast internet. As soon as it comes to 9 minutes, it disconnects
[12:24:21] <ThUnD3r|Gr33n> has someone a custom registration page to register accounts for ejabberd as standard one looks.. let's say ... not as I am expecting :P
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[12:25:26] <Holger> ThUnD3r|Gr33n, the jabber.at people published their stuff, but that's probably some work to set up: https://github.com/jabber-at/hp
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[12:29:17] <Holger> Others include the default thing via iframes to get a bit control over the looks, e.g.: https://blabber.im/anmelden/
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[12:30:13] <Holger> ThUnD3r|Gr33n, or you could just use Converse.js: https://account.conversations.im/register
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[12:34:28] <Holger> justatest, I would enable _only_ a `udp` listener on port 3478 to keep it simple, and then (assuming `eth0` is your external interface): `tcpdump -i eth0 -w /tmp/turn.dump -s 0 udp port 3478 or udp portrange 49152-65535`.
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[12:34:59] <Holger> justatest, then do a 9-minute call and stop `tcpdump` with `Ctrl+C` afterwards.
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[12:36:17] <Holger> justatest, you said you already tested with _only_ `tcp`, right?  And did you find any "failed long-term STUN authentication" entries in your log file?  (If you responded to that question I overlooked it.)
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[12:37:54] <Holger> justatest, the resulting tcpdump file will easily grow to a few GiB.  Maybe make the call audio-only to keep it a little smaller.  And then put it somewhere where I can download it.
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[12:59:42] <zuglufttier> debacle: One question though, what happens if you enable MySQL or PostgreSQL support in the package? Will it draw some external dependencies? Can I look that up for the debian package?
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[13:16:31] <ThUnD3r|Gr33n> danke Holger
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[13:23:45] <justatest> In the logs of ejabberd conversations seem like to be requesting credentials every minute for every client.
If the lifetime is 3-4 minhtes it does only work for 3-4 mins, but anything like 15 or hours would do 9 mins. I'll try to do the tcp dump
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[13:33:15] <Holger> justatest, but *do you see "failied long-term STUN authentication" entries or not*?
[13:33:16] <Holger> πŸ™‚
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[13:33:52] <Holger> justatest, it's normal that clients will (need to) re-authenticate every few minutes (though I wouldn't have quite expected every minute).
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[13:36:00] <Holger> Does anyone have Erlang on Windows?
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[13:43:07] <debacle> zuglufttier I don't know much about ejabberd. Maybe you like to talk to "debalance", not "debacle"?
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[13:43:41] <debacle> (No idea, why we had both the idea of starting our Debian account names with deb...)
[13:43:42] <zuglufttier> Yes, indeed :D
[13:44:11] <Holger> "deba", even.
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[13:49:24] <justatest> There aren't failed stun or turn, all seem successful
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[13:49:46] <Holger> Ok.  Then it's not related to the `credentials_lifetime`.
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[13:50:22] <Holger> Maybe the NAT is killing the UDP connections?
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[13:54:28] <justatest> It's not just did it on 1 minute and it's still going more than a min. It's not udp but on tcp right now. But it's strange, the server has been run on 2 different Internets with different brands of routers. Right, this conversation lasted 4 minutes when it's set on 1 min the credentials. It's somehow connected to that but not sure how. Unless threres a bug for nat. Next cloud talk had it on version 5 before April. However that depended on cpu speed
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[13:57:55] <Holger> The `credentials_lifetime` isn't exact.  It's complicated.
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[14:01:23] <Holger> So playing around with very small numbers won't help you because it doesn't work the way you seem to think it does.  Just set `credentials_lifetime: 12h` and keep that.  And then try other things to track down the issue.
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[14:03:21] <Holger> > Right, this conversation lasted 4 minutes when it's set on 1 min the credentials
(That's precisely to be expected, FWIW.  And in that case you'll see "failed long-term STUN authentication" messages.)
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[14:06:20] <Holger> justatest, just to double-check it's not simply you specifying the lifetime incorrectly?  Do you have `credentials_lifetime: 12h` with the trailing `h`?
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[14:14:05] <justatest> Yes i tried that with h and then it does 9 minutes, I'll try again just to be sure
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[14:54:13] <justatest> Yeah 9 minutes when setting it to 12h same is 15h. The trailing h is they're too
It said could not connect call
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[14:55:07] <Holger> And no "failed long-term STUN authentication" entries right?
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[15:58:10] <sepiol> "ejabberdctl muc_online_rooms ..." lists mucs that I thought I had deleted a long time ago. Now when I try to delete the muc with "destroy_room", I get an error message. Did I miss something? How can I delete those mucs?
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[16:15:32] <justatest> Just found out, it's the router. After turning off the ddos protection and filtering, enabling sip alg, it does 17 minutes
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[16:19:21] <Holger> πŸ™‚
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[16:20:48] <mightyBroccoli> I just read the latest processone blog post wondering why the shaper settings burst_size and rate aren't documented. I assume they are new to 20.04 but I am not really sure. In 20.03 they aren't working though.
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[16:22:27] <Holger> mightyBroccoli, it's there since 18.06.  How does it not work?
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[16:23:05] <mightyBroccoli> I get this:
> ejabberd_config:reload:116 Configuration reload aborted: Invalid value of option shaper->normal: Expected integer, got map instead
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[16:24:30] <Holger> I don't see this with:
```
shaper:
  normal:
    rate: 3000
    burst_size: 20000
  fast: 100000
```
[16:24:50] <Holger> Admittedly I don't have 20.03 to test.  But I dont see anything changed since then.
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[16:25:37] <mightyBroccoli> I will test one sec :)
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[16:29:10] <mightyBroccoli> I guess I must have messed up the indentation somehow. It does work now.
[16:29:41] <Holger> mightyBroccoli: Feel free to post an issue regarding the missing docs πŸ˜‰
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[16:30:37] <mightyBroccoli> I will, I supposed it would be hypocritical not to, as I always point ppl to reading docs :D
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[16:31:24] <Holger> Thanks.  (Would be nice if prefiks could write them, he added the feature.)
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[17:07:41] <Licaon_Kter> mightyBroccoli: the docs are updated, maybe not yet on sito
[17:07:44] <Licaon_Kter> mightyBroccoli: the docs are updated, maybe not yet on site
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[17:08:00] <Licaon_Kter> https://github.com/processone/docs.ejabberd.im/issues/92
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[17:57:49] <mightyBroccoli> Nice :) thank you :)
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[18:06:00] <mfoss> @thund3r|gr33n I need to check how the default registration page looks, maybe we could improve it.
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[18:07:06] <mfoss> does it look like this still? https://www.ejabberd.im/mod_register_web/index.html
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[18:16:36] <zuglufttier> mfoss, last time I tried, it still looked like that πŸ˜‰
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[18:17:13] <zuglufttier> I did have a look at mod_register_web and turned away after realising a bit of HTML and CSS won't be the answer.
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[20:14:05] <justatest> On network 1, there is double nat and from testing changing some settings on 1 router it makes the conversation work for 17 minutes. Hosted on network 2 with only 1 router. On the network 1 with 2 routers its only 9 mins. No matter what setting is put like open nat or dmz on all routers, everything open, no ddos protections or anything that might interfere, on network 1 the server allows only 9 minutes. So it's the router which is netgear is interfering with the hosting.
Maybe the router is recognizing the traffic as bad? Couldn't get turn tls to work. Followed instructions, with only stun (normal, not tls) and turns it doesn't connect at all. Also if setting the port to 3479 so a 2nd server can be run for more tests, it didn't connect at all. So it seems like the ports have to be original ones or they don't work too
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[20:18:37] <Pitho> justatest: Just out of curiosity, Do you use coturn?
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[20:23:44] <justatest> no i use ejabberds stun and turn servers
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[20:26:12] <Pitho> Okay, because I wanted to know if logs are comparable to the situation where I had network issues.
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[20:29:16] <Licaon_Kter> justatest, Conversations does not use TLS (aka stuns/turns) so don't bother
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[20:34:06] <justatest> On github someone said it does. Probably the only way to good it of to use tls as it'll just be like a normal traffic and the router can't detect anything and mistake the traffic
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[20:39:29] <Pitho> Licaon_Kter: Doesn't it use turns with tcp but ignores the validity of the cert?
[20:39:33] <Pitho> https://github.com/iNPUTmice/Conversations/blob/fa752b596d7fba41a0b62011cd91a11af84b1cd6/src/main/java/eu/siacs/conversations/xmpp/jingle/JingleRtpConnection.java#L1130
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[20:41:29] <Licaon_Kter> Or that, I've banged my head on it, still not sure what's going on.
Eg. coturn uses tcp, but ejabberd does not (and fails to work on my setup at least)
Yeah, I'm confused now. πŸ™‚ πŸ™‚
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[20:46:02] <Pitho> Licaon_Kter: also
https://github.com/iNPUTmice/Conversations/commit/f7a0d2031a815a3a3478bc87aa15eee4a60b6971
For me it looks like it does turns, but not in a secure manner, just for passing firewalls.
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[21:24:42] <Holger> Licaon_Kter, ChaosKid42, rom1dep, and anyone else building `master`: I've now pushed the IPv6 support for STUN/TURN and would be interested in feedback in case you update and use `ejabberd_stun`.  Both whether v6 clients seem happy and whether v4-only still works as expected.  With `offer_local_services:` kept to `true`, you could check whether the "Going to offer STUN/TURN service: IP:port (transport)" `[info]` messages logged on startup/reload look right.
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[21:27:47] <Holger> Ah, `turn_ip` is now replaced by `turn_v4_ip` and `turn_v6_ip`.
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[22:03:27] <mfoss> Hmm don’t you think better backwards compatibility would be to keep β€˜turn_ip’ and add β€˜turn_ip_v6’ ?
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[22:06:05] <Holger> mfoss: I added it to our config magic that accepts `turn_ip` and logs a warning.
[22:07:06] <Holger> mfoss: But I was pondering whether it's worth it myself and am totally open to reverting that, and to go for your suggestion.
[22:07:07] <mfoss> Holger: cool πŸ‘
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[22:09:20] <Holger> Also I'm totally open to changing the new option names πŸ™‚  `turn_ipv6_address` or whatever.
[22:09:36] <Holger> I'm always struggling with names.
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[22:11:09] <mfoss> Holger: I’m not an ejabberd dev so don’t put too much into my suggestions ;) but I like to keep things short and simple.
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[22:57:25] <justatest> Ok so this server had issues with netgear routers and no matter what settings you do there, like open nat, no dos protection and open ports, it will work 9 minutes on turn audio
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